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ET
7/04/2002
03:07:36
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 Subject: One criticism
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Message:
The actual trajectory that brings him from being a Jew to being a Nazi is not described in enough detail. Lots of people have trouble with the Hebrew Bible, but what makes him go to the extreme of being a Nazi rather than a radical Jew? These details are left out. Is that detail unimportant, as the Nazism is merely an artistic vehicle for showing the polarities that exist in his psyche?
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jasper
7/04/2002
10:30:56
| RE: One criticism
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Message:
I had some of the same thoughts. I wanted to know what happened to Danny to bring him to this extreme. After I thought about it more, though, I don't know how the film could have honestly shown his transition unless that was perhpas the film's main focus. It seems hard to imagine that 15 or 30 minutes worth of screen time would have been enough to convince us that we really understood Dannny's journey. To me, the story was more about the end of Danny's journey rather than how he got there.
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shai
7/04/2002
10:31:42
| RE: One criticism
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Message:
In response to your criticism, which many have raised, the film maker Henry Bean has said, yes, this is an artistic devise for demonstrating a universal human condition. On the other hand, and Henry would agree with this, many Jews in assimilationist cultures, like ours, are torn between attraction to and revultion from their heritage (in segrationalist cultures, they had no choice). For such people, Danny's dilemma is obvious and did not need to be demonstrated on screen. This is a universal phenomenon, too. We all hate some aspects and love some others of what is closest to us: spouse, family, hometown, nation, religion, etc.
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ET
7/11/2002
19:13:52
| RE: One criticism
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Message:
I think the two previous responses are quite astute. Indeed, it would have turned four-hours long if the transition had been chronicled in a believable way!
I am not a Jew, but my girlfriend is, and she shows a love-hate relationship with her Judaism. One minute she will mock something, the next defend something that (from my perspective) looks equally strange or "different" (as Danny could beat up a Jew one day and be telling his girlfriend not be nude in front of the Torah the next).
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shai
7/12/2002
14:43:31
| RE: One criticism
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Message:
Yes, ET, the chilling aspect of Danny's behavior is his love of Jewish objects and aversion to Jewish people. However, a narrative point that has gotten missed is the role of ordinary human love in Danny's "conversion." In the published screenplay, Danny's father says, in essence, You stopped going to shul when your mother died. (Bean has said publicly that he regrets taking it out of the film. But the missing mother is obviously of some import, even in the more subtle Sundance version of the film) I see Danny's love for Carla (he must love her; he wouldn't tolerate her behavior otherwise) as the rehumanizing element that facilitates his reentry to the Jewish world. I doubt Henry did this consciously, except through the casting. Henry was focusing (Jew that he is) on abstraction and argument. It's Gosling who brought in the romantic/erotic element that completes the picture.
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shai
7/12/2002
14:44:35
| RE: One criticism
IP: Logged
Message:
Yes, ET, the chilling aspect of Danny's behavior is his love of Jewish objects and aversion to Jewish people. However, a narrative point that has gotten missed is the role of ordinary human love in Danny's "conversion." In the published screenplay, Danny's father says, in essence, You stopped going to shul when your mother died. (Bean has said publicly that he regrets taking it out of the film. But the missing mother is obviously of some import, even in the more subtle Sundance version of the film) I see Danny's love for Carla (he must love her; he wouldn't tolerate her behavior otherwise) as the rehumanizing element that facilitates his reentry to the Jewish world. I doubt Henry did this consciously, except through the casting. Henry was focusing (Jew that he is) on abstraction and argument. It's Gosling who brought in the romantic/erotic element that completes the picture.
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sara
12/26/2002
16:46:21
| RE: One criticism
IP: Logged
Message:
abstraction...
if it's true it's a jewish caratheristic
where it come from?
maybe from studying the Torah?
I'm technically a jew and my boyfriend is from eretz israel but I've never gone to a jewish school and never studied the Torah
even if I celebrate pesah... hannukah... etc
The trouble is I can see this abstraction-tendence
in every jew I know (me too) and I can't understand where it comes from
can someone help me?
shalom
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